What vegetables are good to eat raw?

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Permalink Reply by telefunken on December 2, 2008 at 1:09pm

interesting points A.J.

A.J. said: medicine is allopathic. what does allopathic mean 'to create another disease' or to create a temporary disease for removal of another. but there really is no removal of the other, just a redirection of the bodies vital activities.

according to wikipedia:

[snip].....Generally, allopathic medicine refers to "the broad category of medical practice that is sometimes called Western medicine....[snip]

Chinese herbalism doesn't exactly equal Western medicine. (sorry not even close)

My take is that I'd rather function in the practical world than to be overly concerned with theory to the exclusion of having a workable diet / life. If I chew thoroughly or pass my root veggies through a processor such as Vita-Mix or similar blender, I can negate the cellulose issue. I would like to use all the foods and nutrients at my disposal. Yes, even if I have to use modern appliances! **gasp**

I wouldn't get too caught up on the word "medicinal" either. Many herbs can be used medicinally, as well as dietarily (this is not a word) Details matter. If someone takes an herb and experiences positive results, I doubt we have to argue the mechanism.

Theoretical vs. Practical

----tele

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Permalink Reply by telefunken on December 2, 2008 at 4:18pm

I don't know does it? Do you know the mechanism of Chinese herbalism Xerxes? My guess is that it is not very equivalent to Western medicine. You seem to conclude, though, that relief as an effect is all that is needed to characterize the method as equivalently negative. If that reasoning serves you...I can't argue mine further.

which begs the question.....

Is symptom relief always wrong? I've probably taken 4 to 6 aspirin in the last 3 years and gotten the desired benefit. So what? It's a cost vs. risk calculation. I accept the fact that I may have a minor negative effect joining forces with my major beneficial effect. Will I always choose aspirin over a headache symptom? No. I call it navigating a life and making the best choice I can given any situation.

A.J.s understand of herbs is overly simplistic and frankly not very useful to anyone who has benefited from using herbs. What good is rhetoric when results speak for themselves?

----tele

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Permalink Reply by Erin on December 2, 2008 at 4:46pm

I think I can safely say that Chinese herbalsim isn't equivalent to allopathic medicine at all, since it is entirely based on balancing the body's energetic system. BTW- every food has an effect on those energies, too, so herbs are just the cousin of food.
Allopathic is just about symptom relief, herbs have the ability to alter the body's chemistry and energies and bring it back to homeostasis.

A friend of mine who was seriously "incurably" sick cured himself with raw food but now he's a clinical herbalist and he says that the right herbs can help cut the healing process by half. I think that is something worth considering. He says he wishes he had known about herbs when he was healing.
Here's his site,if anyone wants to read about him:
http://www.herbsoflight.com/

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Permalink Reply by Raw'r on December 4, 2008 at 4:19pm

aloe draws OUT infection from what i hear and it is also healing when taken internally. Not just as a medicine but as a food.

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Permalink Reply by telefunken on December 9, 2008 at 11:43am

AJ said: So you would rather justify your known complicated habits because you live in an system and civilization of destruction instead of standing up for what you know to be true?

Tele: I don’t accept the “either / or” nature of your supposition. There are many ways to be in the world. You seem overly confident in your ability to name my motivation for wanting to run some foods through the VitaMix. Are you inside my head AJ? (hey…get outa there!, I keep important stuff up there! : )

I prefer to function in and continuously choose my way through this reality. I won’t be locked into rigid paradigms of thought or action. I consider this a wise and useful strength not a weakness or a compromise. The true compromise, however, is closing our minds to new information for the sake of protecting the ideas our egos have wrapped themselves around and remain hell-bent on protecting and endlessly justifying.

As for our “civilization of destruction”, it operates within the law of cause and effect. Rest assured this cycle will be followed by a time of renewal. Acknowledging the troubles in this world doesn’t compel me to solve them (though they can influence my decisions) and they don’t conflict with what I know to be true.

And what do you mean AJ by “what you (tele) know to be true”? Have we discussed what I know to be true? (or have you assumed to know what I know to be true?.......are you inside my head again?...please see paragraph one!) : )

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AJ said: I don't hate technology, just our dependence on it. Am I not talking to you over the internet?

Tele: I don’t hate our dependence on technology. To me the stage we are at is a reasonable progression of the human mind’s quest for understanding. The evolution of technology is inevitable given the power of human intellect and desire. The challenge is to somehow guide technology toward full responsibility for, and complete awareness of, every thing it creates and affects.

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AJ said: Why would something that is not optimal for us in it's raw state BECOME optimal with the use of technology such as a vitamix or juicer? That doesn't make sense either.

Tele: Who said optimal is the only option? Not me. I never said processing anything is optimal. Processing can certainly be useful though. I’m a big fan of useful.

It can be empowering to know everything is a choice. And the choices I make today are not necessarily the ones I’ll make tomorrow. Why lock ourselves into only one way of function in the name of being pure, original, optimal? I’d rather use tools, technology, information, experience, advice, raw whole foods, raw processed foods, small amounts of whole but minimally cooked foods, occasional restaurant meals, science, superfoods, home grown and mineral enhanced crops, supplements, sprouts, juiced wheatgrass, alternative medicine, Chinese herbalism, deep breathing, stretching, weight training, running, hiking, mindfulness, meditation, sea weeds, self talk, group discussions, reading, listening to informative and inspiring podcasts and audiobooks. (more…)

I’d rather be experimenting and learning and growing and not trying to follow any so called “ideal, original, optimal, etc.” life plan. No one knows better than me what works for me. I will read all I can get my hands on and listen to everyone’s experiences, but I’m certain to not embrace any book or adopt any philosophy that is claimed to be unassailably conclusive and exclusive of all others.

I’m not predisposed to final, conclusive answers in any human quest for knowledge. If we wait long enough new information will always open new questions. Why not adopt an “endless questioning” approach which continuously incorporates all new information and welcomes new discoveries? Seems like a more useful way to navigate the world.

My ego can’t take control when I refuse to give it a common conviction to latch onto and identify with. It’s quieter when I keep it guessing who I am today and what I might do tomorrow.

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AJ said: Re-check your definition of allopathic. It is not only our food system that is processed....but our information as well. Try not to always swallow the first spoon full they give you.

Tele: I provided a link for the definition of allopathic. Please do the same if you wish to proffer an alternative definition.

And about your last sentence. AJ, do you presume to parse information more accurately than I do? I’m not likely to agree, but feel free to give examples and we can talk more about it.

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AJ said: Medicine does not heal. If anything but destructive, medicine is theraputic.

Tele: Drugs can be efficacious in certain circumstances. Keep in mind I’m no fan of most drug therapy. I rarely take drugs and I think most do more harm than good.

If you are bitten by a bat in the Northeast United States this year, there is a higher than normal chance that you could develop rabies as a result. If the bat is tested positive for rabies or if the bat can’t be located (bitten while sleeping for example) the standard protocol is a very quickly administered rabies vaccine. Rabies is nearly 100% fatal. The vaccine is very effective if given without delay. Would you take the drug if the emergency room doctor indicated you were at risk for developing rabies? I think most rational people would… regardless of their raw food / holistic health beliefs.

Here’s the point. Idealism doesn’t always cut it when reality steps in. We all need to make smart choices and sometimes forego the rhetorical for the useful.

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AJ said: Why do you need something when you are sick....but you don't need it when you are healthy?

Tele: Because of cause and effect? I don’t know. Please explain.

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AJ said: Why would a herb(medicine) cause a negative reaction in a healthy person....but it is ok for a sick person?

Tele: Again, herbs and medicines(drugs) are not usually regarded as equal…even if you insist they are. Please give a specific example too.

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AJ said: Medicines are poison by definition. Ask a pharmacologist, they are controlled substances. Why do they have side effects? Because that is their aim, to create a disease to redirect the body.

Tele: Drugs are not poisons by definition. Each drug will have different properties and levels of toxicity in the body. Are you saying that all controlled substances are poisons? What is your definition of poison? What proof do you have that drugs “create a disease to redirect the body”? I’m under the impression that each drug has a unique mechanism.

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AJ said: If you have a boil, which is an outward expression of the body to expel toxins, and you use a topical remedy to suppress the boil.....where did the toxins magically go? Where did they go...but back into the body? As we can see the boil is gone...but the problem not fixed(toxins still in the body). By the way, aloe suppresses boils. Gasp! Aloe?! Do you need aloe when you are healthy? Of course not. Then you don't need it when you are sick either.

Tele: I’m not sure you understand the nature of boils AJ. Apparently there are various causes.

If I were giving a speech a few days from now and I had a big boil between my eyes and I knew Aloe gel would “suppress” it, um…..please pass me the Aloe!! I’ll worry about the supposedly suppressed toxins in my body later!

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AJ said: Herbs may relieve pain and may be complementary therapy to one seeking living in a state where they don't have to feel anything.

Tele: How extreme! There is no argument worth having when you obviously don’t have a working knowledge of herbs. I don’t either but I know they definitely have earned their reputation for helping people deal with various health issues. If you want to disregard this empirical evidence in favor of the programming you’ve received via study of Natural Hygiene or whatever else…All I can say is you are not the first and you won’t be the last.

----tele

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Permalink Reply by Angel on December 9, 2008 at 4:00pm

A.J. Scuse my ignorance but, er... herbs are plants, aren't they? Last time I looked, anyway. It's just us humans that have differentiated between types of plants. I'm certainly not going to avoid a plant because we chose to call it a 'herb'!

Also, doesn't all food have an effect on the body?...be it a so-called herb or whatever. Isn't knowing this why we are all choosing to eat our food raw - so that we ingest it in the form nature intended? We have learned over millennia that the constituents of some foods can help various ailments. This does not make them pharmaceutical drugs!! The pharmaceutical industry has simply chosen to try and isolate some of those constituents but unfortunately forgets about the synergistic properties of those perfect little plants....

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Permalink Reply by Vaughn Sadekni on December 2, 2008 at 5:31pm

Nice! Totally agree with what you said bro. We should not appose technology at all. We should work with it. Our advancements have allowed to consume a more varied diet which could have been the key to our development. We cant compare ourselves to animals as a lot of people still do. We are a totally different species. No we are not primates or gorillas or any other other animal. So why be bound by what they do. Primates dont eat herbs or roots! Yeah they arent typing on a computer, working day or night shifts, under heavy stress, or driving a car either. Come on! :)

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Permalink Reply by Lauren O on December 2, 2008 at 3:14pm

thanks for the chart! i'm so happy my intuition has guided me to follow it very closely!

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Permalink Reply by telefunken on December 2, 2008 at 9:51am

excellent cold weather crop too.

Eliot Coleman:

[snip]...."We plant mostly the crops that we want to have on hand for a quick meal, especially if we get home after the sun is down and everything is frozen up. Both mache and tatsoi can be harvested when frozen solid and look perfectly normal after they thaw".....[snip]------ [link to source]

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Permalink Reply by telefunken on December 2, 2008 at 12:04pm

I'm not sure what the history of Mache is....I think it's been cultivated for a while....

I've had good results with seeds from Johnny's. Here's a link to their Mache offerings.

If the link doesn't work just search the word mache on their site.

love the mache!

: )

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Permalink Reply by Carla on December 2, 2008 at 8:44am

IMHO I would think that the chart is a bit off with regards to tastes. I think our modern or present day palate has been so inundated with many Crappy SAD foods for many of us that we almost need to relearn what tastes mean to us. We raw eaters I would say are leadin the way in relearning what real raw foods tastes like and also have old food tastes to compare this too. I mean many animals eating fresh raw plants that we humans are usually able to eat don't look at maybe a bitter leaf and say "its bitter, 'yuk' but I know its good for me". ( i know thats very general, just trying to make sense)

So maybe we have evolved or changed over time to find certain vegetables unappealing, although I do like most, even the ones said to be bitter like spinach or ginger which I love to chew little pices of.

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Permalink Reply by Vaughn Sadekni on December 2, 2008 at 9:25am

Right on! Bitter is good and very medicinal. Oh boy I hear the "purists" stampeding towards me. I better get a head start!!! ;) If that comment offends anyone just know that I joke around quite a bit. Wanna know the best medicine that tops any "optimal" food? Laughter. Go ahead give it a try! I bet you feel rejuvenated already :)

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