The Real Scam -- Care to Follow Durianrider Off a Cliff?
So how bad do you want to be in denial? How much will you grasp to dogma, not facing the truth that we do so much to harm ourselves?
We rarely listen to our bodies, instead we get whisked away by "gurus" or charismatic people who are the farthest thing from those who bare the truth.
Most of these ego-maniacal know-it-alls are full of it. Not sure about that? Want to know how a strict vegan diet can deplete your body of B12? Read about our friend Harley, aka Durianrider.
From http://health.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=695434:
...remember, Harley completely cuts out anything to do with animal products and relies purely on raw fruit, veggies and nuts. His results have got Susie really worried: "My biggest concern is that your vitamin B12 is one of the lowest clinical levels we have ever seen!"
Harley's B12 was just 78. That's drastically lower than the normal intake range from 145 to 637 and means our vegan could be susceptible to anemia, blurry vision and loss of feeling in the hands and feet in the long term. "In the case of vegans, it's really up to them if they decide to supplement with B12. It is primarily from animal-based food so it's probably worth him discussing it with his GP or medical specialist," says Susie.
Still sure that a diet that you NEED to supplement is the best one for humans? Hmm..... it seems that the DR's take on the 80/10/10 is one of the biggest scams. Follow DR to illness if you like, it's your choice.
What do you have to lose, besides your teeth? Oh yes..., poor vision, no feeling in your hands, and anemia. Oh, to dogma!
We rarely listen to our bodies, instead we get whisked away by "gurus" or charismatic people who are the farthest thing from those who bare the truth.
Most of these ego-maniacal know-it-alls are full of it. Not sure about that? Want to know how a strict vegan diet can deplete your body of B12? Read about our friend Harley, aka Durianrider.
From http://health.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=695434:
...remember, Harley completely cuts out anything to do with animal products and relies purely on raw fruit, veggies and nuts. His results have got Susie really worried: "My biggest concern is that your vitamin B12 is one of the lowest clinical levels we have ever seen!"
Harley's B12 was just 78. That's drastically lower than the normal intake range from 145 to 637 and means our vegan could be susceptible to anemia, blurry vision and loss of feeling in the hands and feet in the long term. "In the case of vegans, it's really up to them if they decide to supplement with B12. It is primarily from animal-based food so it's probably worth him discussing it with his GP or medical specialist," says Susie.
Still sure that a diet that you NEED to supplement is the best one for humans? Hmm..... it seems that the DR's take on the 80/10/10 is one of the biggest scams. Follow DR to illness if you like, it's your choice.
What do you have to lose, besides your teeth? Oh yes..., poor vision, no feeling in your hands, and anemia. Oh, to dogma!
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Debbie Took on
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Someone's just reminded me of what Harley did say . It wasn't a case of 'just not eating so many nuts/so much fat'.
When Harley switched to 811 (which I think would have been shortly after the reading quoted in the opening post), which is a variant of the Natural Hygiene diet, he cut out all stimulants, such as chili. These are toxic and irritate the digestive system. See Mark's post later.
When he removed these from his diet, his vitamin B12 levels 'quadrupled'.
I'm sure he would have supplied this information, had anyone asked him.
This confirms my own feeling about B12, that failure to absorb may in many cases be linked to 'antinutrients' in the diet.
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Permalink Reply by vladimir on -
Read page 246 of 80/10/10 by Dr Douglas Graham.
B12 is added to red bull, fruit loops, yoghurt, milk. Chickens are fed b12 as industry standard, so do farmed fish and cattle.
Measure the b12 in a wild fish and it will be way lower than farmed fish that are fed supplemented b12.
Measure the b12 of a 100% raw fooder whom doesnt supplement or eat animals that have been fed b12 supplements, vegan or not and it will be way lower than a SAD eater typically.
B12 is a bacteria. Some people dont have the healthy guts to produce enough and most people eat a high fat diet that they block the receptor sites.
Some people need b12 supplements, some dont. If in doubt, take a supplement and if you feel amazing, then you probably needed it. A simple way to test isnt it.
We drink dead water, dead air and washed and shipped food. No wonder governments supplement b12 in mainstream foods to keep peeps healthier.
What is really a healthy b12 number and what demographic group is it based on?
If in doubt, take b12. Too easy.
Thats all I have to say on the matter.
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Permalink Reply by Lightlover on -
Multisport, it is good to post this, it is an important question, on the other hand Vladimir is
right that the question about "a healthy B 12 number" is difficult to answer.
I don't know if there are B12 numbers below which the risk for these illnesses have been "proven"?
That's the main question.., NOT what the average B12 level of average people is...
Would be good anyway if DR posts his current B 12 number on 30 bananas a day.com, if he wants a real
discussion, instead of only stating "the truth"....
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Permalink Reply by Lightlover on
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THE BEST Durianrider can do, is make a life-MOVIE about his current B12 testing,
showing the results IN the movie, with the Doctor who is testing him beside his side.
Put it on Youtube...
Would give MUCH more credentials than ANYthing he is doing now..
I say to you: this is not gonna happen! Because it is about preaching, not about
discussions..
Of cause my personal opinion....
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Permalink Reply by Kaybee on -
ok i also read somwhere that given harley is physically healthy, (or at least seems so, given his endurance cycling etc), that MAYBE we should look closer at the "anomaly" of his "very low" B12 level...in the sense that we are using standards that originate in cooked fooders...and that seeing as harley seems to be functioning well with this "low" b12...maybe because hes raw vegan or because whatever...maybe the lower B12 is acceptable for some people if they are really healthy; ie maybe really healthy people dont NEED levels that high? or something. im not arguing this, just suggesting it as an alternative way to look at this, as i had seen this mentioned in another post. also, ive seen it suggested that maybe our guts CAN manufacture B12 high enough up for us to use it IF they are healthy enough...and what debbie says about harley cutting out spices etc would seem to maybe suggest that this made his digestive tract really healthy and maybe capable of producing and absorbing its own B12. although i think that storm and jinjee and their kids use spices, dont supplement and their B12s are fine too... so i dunno
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Permalink Reply by Mellifera on -
Dr. Clement says that it takes time for the digestive system to heal...as long as 3 years. I prefer that explanation.
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Permalink Reply by Mellifera on
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well he states he takes supplements, so I would bet his numbers are now fine. I'm not sure about the fat blocking absorption though. I can't find any pathways or research that supports that, but I would bet that the phytic acids in nuts are no good for it.
I wouldn't push this argument. B12 absorption is very complex and DR had stomach problems that are strongly tied with leaky gut, which impairs absorption.
If anything, his old numbers are interesting because it shows that pre/811, but still raw, his other numbers are fine. So it goes to show that he was actually doing decently without being 811.
I worry that there is too much emphasis on diets being entirely "natural". As DR said, we live in a new world...it's not the world of our ancestors who ate raw. Our soil, food, and water are poisoned and the stuff that is edible is often sterile. It's our own new journey and while learning from the past is wise, we need to adjust that to make up for the realities of the modern world.
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Permalink Reply by Rawzilla on -
Not to stir up controversy, but in the name of telling the truth, I'd like to offer what happened to me--I developed absorption problems on high fruit too. That is a common problem with systemic candidiasis.
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Permalink Reply by Lightlover on
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Mellifera, I read nowhere Dr takes supplements, where did you..?
LL
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Permalink Reply by Mellifera on
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I can't look up his old posts because they are deleted, but I guess I'm reading between the lines of the above post.
DR has b12 issues...says people with these issues should take supplements....pretty likely he took them also.
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Permalink Reply by Mellifera on
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it seems to depend on each individual problem, which is sadly what DR doesn't like to acknowledge. We all have different gut ecologies and genes...and yes, it does seem to really matter despite the fact that the differences tend to be small. I have been to 30BAD and seen that some people are having persistent problems despite being on 811. Others have had amazing success on 811 in just a few days....I would hope that the people who are not finding that 811 is working will continue to have an open mind to trying new things.
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